Is America more sharply divided than ever before? If so, is that a bad thing?
I have heard it said on occasion (and especially after the shooting in Arizona) that America is more sharply divided than ever before–with the obvious exception being the Civil War–but is that really the truth or is it just more rhetoric? And even if we are sharply divided, is that necessary even a bad thing? Those are the two questions I will now attempt to answer.
Americans have always been engaged in a fight (literally and figuratively) for the future direction of the country and this began before America was even a country. Even when war broke out between the colonies and the Crown there were differing opinions–not only about whether we should even be fighting against the motherland, but also about what we were actually fighting for. While the war waged on there were many who wanted to remain loyal to the Crown–after all, they still felt that Britain offered them more freedom than any other nation on earth and they found it treasonous to engage in a battle against her.
And then there was the reason for the fighting: At the beginning of the war we were not fighting for independence, but rather to restore our rights as natural born British citizens, but as the war waged on with England a war also waged on in the minds of our revolutionary leaders. Should we be fighting to restore our rights as British citizens, or should we break from England altogether? We know how that turned out–but at the time it wasn’t certain that the Continental Congress would be able to garner the votes needed in order to declare independence–and certainly after independence was declared there was a large portion of the populace who sided with the British and left for protection behind enemy lines.
But even after independence was won, the bickering and infighting did not stop there and in fact there was quite a contentious battle leading up to the ratification of the constitution. Again, not all people were in favor of replacing the Articles of Confederation, and those that did want to start over could not agree on many principles within the constitution–from slavery, to representation, to how powerful the federal government should be. There was even the prospect of having an “Executive Council” of sorts instead of a single president. These were extremely contentious times and the nation was once again sharply divided.
The two main authors of the “Federalist Papers”–written in defense of the constitution before ratification–Alexander Hamilton and James Madison eventually feuded over the powers of the federal government after the constitution was ratified.
Thomas Jefferson and Alexander Hamilton’s feuds over the national treasury, federal power and Revolutionary War debt are legendary and many times these two nearly came to blows. Even the location of the federal government became a divisive issue because of the power the region would gain if it were the capital.
While he was Vice-President of the United States, Thomas Jefferson spent four years actively trying to undercut the President, John Adams–who once were great friends, but turned on each other over how powerful the federal government should be–and render him useless and ineffectual as president.
And who can possibly forget that while he was Vice-President, Aaron Burr shot and killed Alexander Hamilton in a duel? It certainly doesn’t get much more contentious or divided than that.
From Preston Brooks beating Charles Sumner with a cain until he laid unconscious on the Senate floor in 1856, right up until the Civil War Americans remained divided on many issues. Even after the Civil War–from woman’s suffrage in the early 1900s to the civil rights movement in the 1960s (it doesn’t get much more violent than that)–Americans have never been able to see eye to eye on many controversial issues, but we are allowed to voice our differences and debate the merits of our position. That is a right that is afforded to us in the constitution and while the rhetoric may get heated at times, that is to be expected that during a debate in a free society when so many people have so many differing opinions.
So, I as again: Is America really more divided now than ever before? The answer to me is simple, NO. There have always been debates that have shaped the future of the nation and there have always been people who vehemently opposed the direction the country has taken–and in some cases it got violent. But looking back on the heated rhetoric of the past I think I am safe in saying that in the long run America has become a better country because of it.
Now we are engaged once again in bitter partisan battles, fighting for the direction of our country and while the rhetoric might be soaring it is hard to believe anyone thinks this is something new that has occurred in the last two years. And when the very direction of our country is at stake, everyone should have a say in the process and an opinion on the direction and it should be voiced. If that makes for a loud and at times contentious battle–so be it.
The future direction of the country should be too impassioned of a debate to sit idly by and watch from afar. To sit idly by and passively submit to the will of our leaders will, over time, result in a soft tyranny over the people. In a free society we have the chance to form the future of the country and while we may be divided and while we may get angry with one another once in awhile, that is a product of that free society. And it sure as hell beats the alternative.
So, is it a bad thing that Americans are sometimes sharply divided? Again, I think that answer is NO. Great good can come from dissent and debate and we, as Americans, owe it to our children to fight to create the best America we can for their future. We may differ over what the definition of a better country is, but that is part of the beauty of living in a free country and I would have it no other way.
America's Watchtower 
FROM: ” http://www.joshcomm.org/shortstories/baptism.html ”
Reaching into his pocket, he pulled out a quarter and held it in the air, and panned it to the class.
“How many sides are there to this coin, Chris?”
“Two, sir.”
“And you, Randy, how many?”
“Two, sir!”
“Both of you are wrong,” said Mr. Jonathan, “for there are actually three sides! Please sit down Chris and Randy.”
Silently looking around the class, Mr. Jonathan then continued.
“Diverse denominations; or religions for that matter; are formed due to mans narrow focus on what they perceive to be truth. If you are involved with, or partake in one narrow view, you become no different than a denomination of Scribes, Pharisee, or Sadducee, whom persecuted Jesus or His disciples when they walked this earth. They persecuted because of their denominational views, their hardened hearts, and the threat of loss of power, or prestige. The same can be applied to the denominations, or religions, of today.”
“Applying this to this coin I hold before you,” as Mr. Jonathan pointed to one side of it, “one side of the coin is Chris’s view of that baptism from John the Baptists’ perspective. Chris is correct, as also seen in Matthew three, verses thirteen through seventeen, that John actually heard God say ‘This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well-pleased.’ God’s voice, was directed, to John’s hearing.”
Then Mr. Jonathan turned the quarter over to show the other side. Pointing to this side, he continued.
“On the other side of this coin, is Randy’s view, who saw things from the perspective of Jesus’ view of that baptism. God’s voice, as you have heard from Randy, was directed to the ears of Jesus for His hearing. And now, we come to the third and final side of the coin.”
As Mr. Jonathan held the quarter so that the edge showed, he pointed to that edge as he panned it high for all to see, from one side of the class to the other. Then he continued.
“Looking, you will see a thin edge, or narrow band, that lies between the other two sides, that joins them together. This narrow band is truth, and can be seen more clearly after searching and understanding both sides shown. What is really transpiring here, gentlemen?”
It may be that this nation may be divided, but there will ALWAYS be three sides to a coin, the third side is hidden and must be sought out clearly.
Jon C. Randall
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There will always be a solution to the problems, we just have to be willing to debate the terms and come to an agreement. That is a great story to illustrate this.
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Thank You.
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You are welcome.
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Is America more sharply divided than ever before?
I certainly hope so. We have libbers that are brainless, we have an RNC that is just as bad as the Dems, we have a GOP that is nothing more than *Dem Lite* and then we have Conservatives, standing free and proud, calling both groups on their BS…
Divided? Damn right we’re divided, and as for me, I will NEVER acquiesce to the cries of ‘toned down rhetoric’, all that gives us is a mass of people that have shown that they have NO GUTS and are afraid to take a stand!
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“Toned down rhetoric” is nothing more than trying to shut up our side of the debate and we should never agree to do so just so that the liberals can have their way unopposed.
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Exactly!
That was part of the subtext of BHO’s speech in Tucson last week.
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Yes it was, in essence he was telling us to stop arguing with him.
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More divided than when Bill Clinton stood for impeachment charges in the U.S. Senate? More divided that when LBJ plunged us deeper into Vietnam or when Carter was voted out of office? I don’t think so. I still think apathy in terms of how many people vote is pretty high.
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We have always been divided, for the most part most elections are fairly close. This demonstrates the fact that there will always be debate on the issues, and there should be.
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Yes I do believe our country is deeply divided. Part of it is our fault, part of it is the constant unfocused rhetoric being streamed into our homes. We as a country seem to have taken the standards of real debate and thrown them out the window. The two fundamental requirements of debate is 1)use FACTS to prove your point, not prejudice and personal bias and 2)stay on topic.
Somehow we have managed to turn all of that on its head, I blame the education system.
There are certain things that are personal issues, yes we have to create laws for them, no we should not do it based on our own prejudices. We should be following the golden rule. Do onto others. Its really as simple as that.
Don’t call me stupid during a debate, because you wouldn’t like it if I called you stupid. Don’t hate our president for being black, because we haven’t hated ALL of our past presidents for being white. Just because we’re different, doesn’t give us the right to make assumptions. And that includes the assumption that one party is better than the other. Until we get a bill for campaign finance reform voted on, guess who all of those politicians are inevitably looking out for: #1, self.
There is no space in politics for bigotry and hate of anyone, because we are ALL Americans. When other countries hate us, when China finally owns us, they don’t hate/own the left or the right, or the south or the north, east or west, it is us as a unit.
Don’t assume that the other sides ideas come from a bad place, because the goal is always the same, for the sake of country. We need to make it so Big Business isn’t the one voting and puppeteering the conversation. Because while we’re bickering with our petty distractions, they are taking advantage, making their dollars, and putting the rest of us in a hole.
Whether it be through healthcare, loans, taxes, welfare, etc, they are buying the vote and making out like bandits, and we’re just screaming at each other.
A divide in our country is not a good thing, because while we’re fighting, we’re forgetting about the man behind the curtain. “Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!”
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I thought that you made some good points, but I found it unfortunate that you decided to throw the race card out there. This post had nothing to do with Barack Obama’s race, I was simply taling about the divisions in the country based on the policies of the past and the present.
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When the left decries our divisions, they are suggesting that we surrender our freedoms and join the nanny state without resistance. It is a false argument, as you point out, since we have always been divided along some line or another.
As long I am able to draw a breath, I will keep the division going. If we stop being divided, it means something terrible has happened.
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What the left wants is for us to give up and let them do whatever they want to and that is not what this country is about. You are right, if we stop being divided, something terrible will have happened. We will have given into the state and we will be under their control.
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The post and comments are all very well thought out and said, and did much to make me feel better about the current climate. I must say however, that in my lifetime, I know of no President that has done more to incite us, and condone the false cries of racism and bigotry, and for that I am very, very angry. Certainly the worst leadership in my lifetime, and then, add to that the Main Stream media support of it, and lies, and there is much cause for concern as the average person is too lazy to pursue the truth. Signed, still worried.
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I have to agree–Barack Obama may turn out to be the most divisive president in history. He has incited–or at best, refused to put out the fires–people with his arrogance and his unwillingness to listen to the people.
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We are not all Americans ad lib, hence the immigration debacle.
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If you become a citizen, then you are American, you have to pay taxes, you can legally enroll your children into school, you’re basically subject to all of the benefits and shortcomings that being an American entails. If you are an illegal immigrant, then you cannot vote and I’m not talking about you.
And I will repeat, stay on topic.
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It seems I am going to have to work harder to find a real republican blog, because this one does not seem to be issue based. It looks to be the same petty bickering that I was talking about. If you aren’t going to discuss the issues, then you’re not debating!!! You don’t have a voice in the long run because you’re not saying anything. I can say I’m unhappy with they way things are going too, ((RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE)) But how can you prove your way is the best way without breaking it down!?!?!?
Somehow my comment on us being American’s turned into “the immigration debacle” which you didn’t even bother to elaborate on. Oh yeah, and it had nothing to do with the topic, which was our countries divide. We can be divided on the issues, so long as you focus on the issues, and not your own personal shit!
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You forget your meds today? Or having a bad hair day? WOW
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Non sure how Add Lib can claim I am not issues based! Although her name suggests that she really isn’t interested in debate, but rather wants to stoke the fires even more.
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I am not sure why you have decided that this is not an issues based blog. I write about current events and issues almost every single day, on occasion I write general topic posts–which is what this one was–but for the most part I cover as many issues as possible. Perhaps you should scroll through some of my previous posts before claiming that this blog does not revolve around the issues.
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Um while you do state alot of current events involving issues, I don’t really see any arguments on the issues, it seems to be understood that you’ve taken the standard “conservative view.”
I see you throwing Michael Steele under the bus (big surprise) while praising the Sarah Palin. It seems to me once again, you’ve jumped on the Fox News bandwagon of reporting the events, but not breaking them down into any information that we can use to create policy. This particular blog was just a history lesson on American divisions, that I don’t really see how it connects now. In some strange way your are saying because we’re not shooting the VP or desecrating the Senate Floor, it’s not so bad.
I see you didn’t use anything a little more recent in our divisions, like Iraqi war, and how that’s blowing up in our faces. Our disregard for Korea, Iran, and Mexico (they are an issue, and not just immigration).
You do like to condemn us “evil liberals” and call Obama arrogant (which I dont understand, Bush strong-armed us into a war and gas is still going up, if that’s not arrogance, I dont know what is), but I’m not hearing anything really relavent to breaking down the issues and how decisions help or hurt us. Just because is not cutting it.
And as far as my bringing race into it, its a reality of living in a melting pot where some of our citizens are fighting the melting and are circumventing debating and coming together on the issues, because “they don’t like him and his ‘arrogance.'” These are not arguments and they don’t bring us any further. I stand by my statement. And good luck with that.
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First, I am not a Sarah Palin fan, I do not think that she is a legitimate candidate for president. Although I did defend her in the aftermath of the Arizona shooting because she was unfairly targeted (can I still use that word?)as the reason behind the shooting. I have never “praised” her, and I never will.
As far as Fox News goes–you may not believe this but I do not watch any television news and I do not listen to Rush, Hannity, Beck (I don’t even like Beck, he gives me a headache) or any of the others, and I don’t so that I can’t be accused of just parroting what they say.
The point of this post was not to imply that because a VP hasn’t shot anyone that all is not so bad–the point of this post was to show that there have been sharp divisions in this country over the years and in the end we have come out better for the debate on those issues. This post was not meant to debate or break down any issue in particular.
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Oh yeah, and I never called you an “evil liberal” either.
As for not posting any examples of current divisive issues, the reason is simple: This post was meant to contrast the divide currently in the country with historical references and examples in order to show that the country has been divided since before we were a country. I didn’t feel it necessary to cover the issues concerning the last 8-10 years because we all know what they are.
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Well………..this aught to help your thought process some then Add Lib
http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2011/01/together-we-writhe.html
Now you want to see issues and/or division…………..enjoy what you are about to see.
Jon
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The fact that even the applause was scripted makes that whole thing even more unappropriate than it was before, and then for Robert Gibbs to loe about it…..
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Ad lib, you’re condescending, insulting, and you’ve played the race card for good measure. Who are you to lecture anybody on the divisions in this country?
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Typical game plan from the left. She throws bombs and then gets upset when someone tried to defend themself.
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Well, for a post that doesn’t break down the issues and just repeats what Fox News says, you did pretty good, Steve. Man, why did I have to go to a wedding and miss this post yesterday, just when the fun was starting.
First of all, you are right to say that the country is no more divided than it has ever been before. All one has to do is look at real American history to understand that harsh and loud debate has often been the mainstay of American politics. I think the ability to have such debate and discussion and come out stronger on the other side is part of what makes America great.
Okay, now to Ad Lib. If you would only take the time to read through Steve’s posts, you will find that he does break down the issues and does a fine job of it. You would also find that he is no fan of Sarah Palin or talk radio. Once again, that will require you actually reading his blog, instead of jumping to conclusions. As for playing the race card with Barack Obama’s black roots, let me point two things. First, the man is only half black and second, you must be taking lessons from him on playing said race card, since he has been doing that since he took office. I, for one, am getting extremely tired of it of hearing all of our arguments against him being blamed on the fact that we do not like his skin color. That has nothing to do with it.
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Thanks for the defense and the kind words Larry! I hope that you enjoyed yourself at the wedding.
It is fairly obvious now that Add Lib jusy wanted to throw a few bombs to ignite a fire, so that she could come back and complain about the responses that she new would be coming. She is not interested in debate.
The left likes to play the race card because they feel they can make our disagreements with the president invalid. By claiming that we only hate him because he is black and not because of the issues is their was of trying to makes us seem illegitimate.
Did you notice the way she quietly used the race card in one of her follow up comments? She said: “I see you throwing Michael Steele under the bus (big surprise)” suggesting that I oppose Michael Steele because he is black.
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Some more thought for you Add Lib and all………….
If you noticed, the cameras were very tightly controlled to show only the front row with the “We the Government” and the people we wanted to included in this photo op next to the Big O to use them; the stage area only and the steps leading up to it; the curtained area to the right of “We the Government” that showed those sitting in there in the frontal portions; and one camera range that was expanded to show some of the crowd just past “We the Government.” Even though the main part of the auditorium AND THE FOOTBALL FIELD were filled with students, NO cameras were put on them, period. Therefore the “Together We’ll Thrive” t-shirts with the additional printing on the bottom were left out, as well as the main scoreboard where the prompts were put on. Simply amazing.
They played on the interns mind who held Gabby and made him a hero, and put him right next to the Big O in the “We the Governement” group. Keep an eye on his career down the road. I believe his name was Kevin, and even though he declined the honor, the Big O restored it upon him in his speech right after Kevin gave his.
What really troubled me the most was that both Nepolitano and then Holder walked up to the stage and read Scripture. That blew my mind. Here we have Nepolitano who will shred your privacy by backscatter nude photos, the I’ll pat down the kids and granny too with aggressive caresses reserved only for a man and woman in bed, the male homos running their hands over the mail groin area to get their jollies in the name of “security and defense,” and she is reading scripture?
The same with Holder, who supports islamic takeover of the institutions of the US, won’t prosecute black trouble groups (I said it………BLACK), who violate our voting privileges, the backing down of ACORN procsecutions0, and the trying to override the security of the citizens of the US by bring in the terrorist into the continental US from a safety haven in Cuba (now we can fly there to Cuba to spend money we don’t have). And Holder was reading Scripture?
This was totally unreal………….and a shame. He used the bodies of the dead to walk over them, and over the common sense of the common man, to herald his (I’m firing a shot across the bow and announcing my campaign run in 2012) “memorial speech.” Red flags should have been seen by everyone.
Jon C. Randall
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The more that I think about that debacle, the worse it seems! This was a disgraceful performance and proved once and for all that the left has no shame.
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Excellent post!
Our of division and debate on the issues will come a kind of unity. May it bee the kind of unity that is in keeping with the intent of our Constitution.
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Thank you!
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This was a great post Steve. I agree with you that we are no more divided today then the founders were when they were crafting the constitution. I think the big reason that the MSM is making such a stink about it is because in order for one side to gain the advantage over the other, you need for them to shut up and sit in the back of the bus. Obama’s words not mine. Spirited debate was not only common but necessary for the republic and for those looking to tone it down clearly lack any understanding of our history. I’m sorry I missed this post yesterday. This is right up my ally and I love to discuss this topic. I’ll make sure it makes our Sunday links.
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Thanks John, for the compliment and the coming link! I think debate is a fundamental necessity in a free society and I find it troubling that some people think it is counter-inuitive to the future of the republic.
I think the 24 hour news cycle and all of the cable news stations looking for a story make it seem as if there is more divide today because of the coverage it now gets, as well as how quickly it is delivered to the people.
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I can’t resist rewording a little Add Lib logic:
You called Obama arrogant but you didn’t call Bush arrogant therefore you’re wrong!
One of your commenters picked out a tidbit from my rant that he didn’t like and I don’t like that he did that, so all you guys do is bicker! And you are petty!
Constant unfocused rhetoric is being streamed into all our homes, by which I really mean YOUR homes you crazy Fox watchers!
Don’t call me stupid and do unto others like the Golden Rule says, except for when I call you petty with nothing useful to say and focused on your own personal “shit” and when I reject your arguments out of hand by claiming they aren’t arguments at all. I can say things like that to you but you can’t say them back!
And my personal favorite: “This particular blog was just a history lesson on American divisions, that I don’t really see how it connects now.” (Rewording could not possibly top the humor of this quote. No connection between past American divisions and current ones? How is that possible? Our nation’s entire history is connected, not discrete and unrelated random occurrences.)
I know, I know, not quite enough exclamation points in my comment. But using multiple exclamation points is totally off limits because it enflames the rhetoric so. Somebody might see my punctuation and be pushed into violence, or something.
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You just can’t help feeding the trolls, can you? I think you summed up Add Lid perfectly!
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Ok this is going to be my last comment, I will be starting my own blog. Lets see if you guys can figure out which one is mine. 🙂
1) My comment about Michael Steele was a test. It had nothing to do with his race, he was the head of the RNC at the time of the Repubs got voted out, it was only natural he would indirectly be held accountable, like all of his predecessors. Yet inevitably race came up, none of which was my own doing.
2) I would hope that our generation would be a bit better than we have been historically, which is why I dont think the history initially stated in this excerpt is relevant. If you don’t think we can do any better than carrying around our muskets and screaming at the capital…………….
Inspire and replace, dont incite and destroy. If you have a well constructed plan to bring we Americans forward, then SPEAK UP, but if you just want to “make the boss look bad” then sit down, you can do no more for us. AND
3) If you don’t want my perception of the alltogether opinion of Obama on this blog to be somewhat based on his race, then bring your f-ing A game to the arguments. Dont tell me he’s arrogant and that he’s got his “propoganda arm” to keep him from speaking half-truths and distractions?
You want to tell me why and how taxes on the rich will be detriment to our country??, or why DADT deeply affects us??? It doesn’t; banking, healthcare, unemployment deeply affect us (as we speak companies have the nerve to threaten outsourcing when we’re at an underestimated 10% unemployment rate). These are issues your side has made relevant while Big Business is raping our country. And that was the only point I was initially trying make. That while we bicker, America gets a little poorer, a little less powerful, and a little unhappier, but somehow our top 10% accrues record numbers.
And while happiness is not everything, its fleeting really; do we have to kick each other in the nads with bitterness and spite to feel we’ve won an argument? No, do your research, write your congressman, make a plan, don’t get too riled up at what Add Lib has to sayy.
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Actually, Michael Steele was not head of the RNC when the Republicans were voted out. That happened before he took over as chairman of the RNC, which was in January of 2009.
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Good point, and further proof that she was indeed making an implication of Michael Steele’s race when she made the comment.
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“Big Business is raping our country.” ah yes, a dab of Marxism pads the argument nicely. I’ll try not to get too riled up, but all the exclamation marks earlier have still got me in a tizzy! And now with the multiple question marks, I’m left confused too!
And yes, kicking my opponent in the nads would definitely make me feel like I’ve won the argument.
Happy blogging dude or dudette.
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Add Lib is a dudette, and she still can’t get past the fact that this post was not about proposing answers to today’s problems.
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“Ok this is going to be my last comment, I will be starting my own blog. Lets see if you guys can figure out which one is mine.”
You think we’ll take the time to try to find you? Don’t flatter yourself. From what you showed us here, you are not worth the time, unlike Steves’ Blog. Have a nice trip.
Jon
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http://bigjournalism.com/klarrey/2011/01/15/together-we-thrive-originated-from-violent-political-rhetoric-t-shirts-contained-rocking-the-vote-dnc-slogan/
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I hope that she provides us with a link, I wouldn’t mind heading over there to see what she has to say.
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So, your comment on Michael Steele was a test? Therefor you purposely made a comment which you knew would make people think that you were playing the race card yet again, and then when people say you were playing the race card you deny that this test involved a comment made to make us think you were playing the race card? Only in a liberal’s mind would that make any sense.
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